1.7M views · Apr 1, 2019 · 21:19 · 6 HN recommenders · 11 mentions · discussed 2019–2025
Dan Olson of Folding Ideas critiques Fortnite's monetization, arguing it uses manufactured discontent, such as shop design and skins, to push spending. The video dissects the psychological techniques behind the game's business model.
Why Hacker News points people here: HN commenters cite it as the definitive critique of Fortnite's monetization and of manipulative free-to-play design.
“There's a great video[1] that goes into detail on the psychological manipulation used in Fortnite's monetization model.”HN comment, 2019
“The tour-de-force on Fortnite's insane process”
Thorough takedown of Fortnite's monetization process.
> Fortnite, in my opinion, has been a gold standard for F2P monetization. No gambling, no randomized loot boxes, etc. Hard disagree. The tour-de-force on Fortnite's insane process this video
“lengthy, thoughtful, and often artistic video essays and skits addressing culture and politics”
Listed among favorite thoughtful culture video essay channels.
My favorite corner of YouTube— lengthy, thoughtful, and often artistic video essays and skits addressing culture and politics— is flourishing right now. Some examples: Unfolding Ideas – this video ContraPoints – link Philosophy Tube – link Lindsay Ellis – link Innuendo Studios – link HBomberguy – link and so on. And it seems like it's only in the past couple of years that many of these channels have reached their current levels of artistry and production value. Most stuff on YouTube is trash, but there's plenty else to watch.
“There's a great video[1] that goes into detail on the psychological manipulation used in Fortnite's monetization model.”
Details psychological manipulation in Fortnite's monetization model.
Make no mistake, this is an entirely intentional consequence of Fortnite's design. There's a great video[1] that goes into detail on the psychological manipulation used in Fortnite's monetization model. It saddens me that a hobby that brought me so much joy as a kid/teenager now preys on the same insecurities it once sheltered me from. [1] this video
“Folding Ideas has a great video [2] (that the Errant Signal video references) dissecting the monetization systems in Fortnite and their negative aspects.”
Dissects Fortnite's monetization systems and their negative aspects.
I think Errant Signal has a great video [1] dissecting the appeal and breadth of content in Fortnite. It's not my cup of tea, but I certainly don't think you can call it "shallow". On the other side, Folding Ideas has a great video [2] (that the Errant Signal video references) dissecting the monetization systems in Fortnite and their negative aspects. [1] link [2] this video
“this video[1] presents a good critique without mentioning aesthetics.”
Good critique of Fortnite, notably the central role of the shop.
If you have 20 minutes, this video[1] presents a good critique without mentioning aesthetics. It's especially notable how central the shop is to the whole experience. I personally found Fortnite to be a huge slog to play - with tons of downtime compared even to games like CS: GO, let alone old-school arena shooters like Q3. The only thing that kept me coming back is the season pass reward tracks and daily missions. [1] this video
“For a more detailed exploration of the dark side of Fortnite's monetization model, check out”
Detailed exploration of the dark side of Fortnite's monetization.
Fortnite's a good example about how your two rules aren't enough, actually. Because of the way the game's designed, it pressures its audience (of primarily children) into purchasing microtransactions, to the point where there's been widespread bulling of kids who don't pay for premium Fortnite skins [1]. For a more detailed exploration of the dark side of Fortnite's monetization model, check out "Manufactured Discontent and Fortnite" [2]. [1]: link [2]: this video
“If you enjoyed reading that you might like Folding Ideas breakdown of Fortnite -”
Breakdown of Fortnite for readers who liked the Mario Kart Tour piece.
First, that was an amazing breakdown of what's happening. If you enjoyed reading that you might like Folding Ideas breakdown of Fortnite - this video Second, I've personally become very wary of any mobile app that introduces multiple currency types. There's gold, and rubies, and power balls, and stardust! At some point pretty early on I decide it's not worth it to figure out how much things /actually/ cost and delete the thing. My understanding is that the math shows companies that microtransactions are the winning move over and over again. I hope that eventually there's enough grumpy consumers both parties become worth serving better.
“Folding Idea's analysis of Fortnite [0] suggests that it does.”
Analysis of how Fortnite obscures prices by showing few items.
I haven't played fortnite, but Folding Idea's analysis of Fortnite [0] suggests that it does. As a specific example, it presents only a small subset of the items available to purchase any given day. This allows them to obscure the relative prices in a way that would not be possible with many more viewable for comparison. A microphone hammer is 800v today. How does that price compare to a gold hammer, or what was its price two seasons ago ? [0] this video
“This really supports Dan Olson manufactured discontent assertion[0].”
Cites Dan Olson's manufactured discontent thesis about skins.
I find it fascinating that in that ad the schlubs that are sitting there watching the television are Fortnite default skins and not say, replicas of the characters that hold the same position in the original Apple ad. This really supports Dan Olson manufactured discontent assertion[0]. Even if you support them and play their game, if you don't spend money for skins, you're still in Big Brother's audience. The wildest thing is that the Jackboots behind the hammer thrower are approximate replicas of the Apple Ad. [0] this video
Linked as evidence that consoles allow Fortnite.
> The consoles would never allow them They allow Fortnite[1], don't they? Or more recently Genshin Impact, which is a pure "gatcha" game - as "mobile" as it gets - and is probably doing very well[2] on PS4/5. [1] this video [2] link Edit: Oh, I totally forgot about the original console "strip you of your money" game: Fifa[3]. [3] link
“Some of my disdain can be summarized via the Folding Ideas essay [1].”
Cited as summarizing the commenter's disdain for Fortnite.
Okay, let me preface with an apology. The parent comment received the brunt of my ire and I feel that's inappropriate as no one person deserves that as my angst is more directed to the fundamental system architecture and not the surrounding commentary. at_19, sorry for the rebuke and the sarcasm. That being said. Metaverses are great. I think there is an underpinning philosophical element to these discussion around aggregate universes that needs to be addressed. My particular disdain is targeted at Fortnite. Some of my disdain can be summarized via the Folding Ideas essay [1]. My disdain may or not be intrinsically linked to the ideals of capitalism, for which I think there is a larger discussion to be had. I believe, by all interpretation, Fortnite is a vehicle solely for capitalist ideals and doesn't allow room for alternative economic models (including capitalist synergies). This, in concert with its branding (a childrens' game) is problematic for me. Fortnite, in its essence, is an anarcho-capitalist model. The literal goal of any drop is zero sum by nature. Kill everyone else -> read kill as not literally kill, but subsume their resources and remove players so that one dominant entity can capture resources. Part of the core gameplay is leveraging resources "enemies" have already obtained, mechanical efficiency, and coordination (if not solo-queued) against "the others". The game, by its mechanics, is troublesome to me. This is not to mention the pure pay-to-win psycholog
